AS HEARD ON...
Sandbox Studios Founder
& Director
KIANA “ROOKZ”
EASTMOND
For the full interview, listen to the May 1, 2019
episode of the podcast
CM: It’s been pointed out that urban
music artists in Canada don’t benefit
from the same industry infrastructure
and institutional knowledge that, say,
country or roots or indie rock artists
do. They don’t have the same pipeline
of showcases, development programs,
and festivals, or decades of label and
management expertise behind them. Is
that changing?
Rookz: I think a lot of people forget that a
lot of urban music is created by people of
colour, and a lot of people of colour are first-
generation [immigrants]. And so, when you
look at it from just a numbers perspective,
previous to now when urban music has
become extremely popularized… it used to
be a subgenre and I think the lack of num-
bers here for people to support it, there just
wasn’t as much desire from the Canadian
music industry to invest in it.
Now I am seeing that change a little bit,
but the fundamental problem with a lot of
music is that when there is a folk or alterna-
tive music artist in Canada, they can go and
get signed to a label or do something to
create funding for themselves that way. The
majority of the music funding, programming,
or showcasing of urban music in Canada
comes through violence intervention pro-
grams and it comes from a social place.
So, when a label says, “I’m going to give
you money to make your music,” that is an
economic investment in you that you’re
going to make more money. When we tell
artists in Canada who are making urban
music that we’re going to invest in them,
George Goodrich, Founder & CEO of
PLAYLIST PUSH
For the full interview, listen to the May 29, 2019 episode of the podcast
CM: Can you explain how Spotify is identifying indie songs
to move up through its data-driven hierarchy of playlists
before ending up on the very prominent playlists?
George Goodrich: I
always tell people that
you actually don’t want
to get on one of those
massive playlists until
you’re ready. That’s be-
cause if your song is just
below songs by Drake or
Rhianna and everyone
skips your song, that’s
going to lose you that
spot on that playlist the
next time it updates. It
basically tells Spotify that
no one likes your music,
which could basically put
you in a hole for the rest of your releases that are coming out on
the platform.
The best thing to do is to get the music out to user-generated
playlists, and that helps you build data for your profile. Playlist
Push can help you get on playlists, but if people aren’t saving your
song and they don’t like it and you’re not getting those repeated
listens, those are the things that are going to trigger those different
feeder playlists on Spotify. So, if people are saving the song and
repeatedly listening to it, then it will get traded up into these more
algorithm-based playlists, which we call “feeder playlists,” like Fresh
Finds, and then you can graduate from that. If people are again
saving the song and repeatedly listening to it, then it can get up
into even bigger playlists. That is kind of how it works.
that usually comes from some sort of not-
for-profit or social-impact space. Because
it comes from a social impact space, the
investment and the return-on-investment
looks different… Urban music hasn’t devel-
oped in Canada because it’s not about how
good you are; it’s about how many boxes
you check for grants. As an organization,
if your funding is for you to create space
for marginalized people of colour and the
queer community, you’re looking for people
who look like that versus looking for talent.
So, I think that’s really held back the urban
music industry here.”
David Penn, Co-Founder of
HIT SONGS DECONSTRUCTED
For the full interview, listen to the May 22, 2019 episode of the podcast
CM: After nearly a decade of pulling
apart and analyzing hit songs, what
are the key lessons you’ve learned
about writing a hit pop song?
David Penn: [Writing a hit song] boils
down to two things: it’s blending in and
standing out. You know, familiarity and
the unique spin. That’s it in its broadest
sense and if you remember that, then
you just drill down for success. Basically,
you need to be in-tune with what’s
happening today and you need to
incorporate either certain production
elements and song structures, and
obviously hooks and the whole melody aspect and lyrics and all that.
You have to make the song so that it easily connects with a wide audi-
ence. Also, remember that you’re composing for the audience at this
level and not for yourself. If it’s for yourself, then it’s typically a hobby.
But if you really want to compete in the mainstream music scene and
try to get a hit, you have to connect with the audience and that’s the
familiarity aspect.
But at the same time – and this goes against what so many people
think when they think of pop hits – people think it all sounds the same
and it does not, because when you look at the upper reaches of the
charts, there is always something different. There is a unique lyrical spin,
like from Ariana Grande’s “thank u, next” or “7 Rings” or “God Is a Wom-
an.” Or there is a production element. There is always something that
helps the song stand out amongst everybody else and get noticed. In a
nutshell, that is the true recipe, in conjunction with a hook that is really
great. So, it’s that familiarity so you connect, and that originality so you
stand apart.
Listen to new episodes of the Canadian Musician Podcast every Wednesday at www.canadianmusicianpodcast.com.
All episodes can be found on the website or through Apple Podcasts, Google Play Music, Stitcher, or wherever you get your podcasts.
18 CANADIAN MUSICIAN